QA with Tina Ling, MD Hays France - Viewpoint - careers advice blog Viewpoint careers advice blog

QA with Tina Ling, MD Hays France - Viewpoint - careers advice blog Tina Ling Hays In this interview, Tina Ling, MD Hays France, based in Paris, shares her experience of gender diversity in the workplace, speaks about her progression into a leadership role and assesses the results of our Global Gender Diversity Survey in France. What was your route to Hays? I started working with Hays straight after graduation from university. I began as a consultant for the Construction and Property (CP) sector, was promoted to senior consultant and was then responsible for managing an office. I then merged the Croydon and Bromley offices into one. My next step was to launch the FM and Maintenance division from scratch for the CP business in the UK; I launched CP nationally so that it was a service we offered in all UK offices. After this I won the first RPO for CP with a renowned FM company, an account which went from zero to £ 4million turnover in its first year. In August 2000 I was speaking with Dennis Waxman, former CEO of Hays Recruitment, about why Hays didn’t have a presence in France. As soon as January 2001 I was heading up a team of five in Paris; we began by launching CP because there was a massive demand for it in the market. Finance and Accounting was the second sector launched (September 2001) and currently Hays France offers all 21 specialist sectors across 16 offices and employees over 500 professionals. Tell us about your progression into a leadership role, what challenges did you face along the way? When working for Hays, whether you’re male or female, all consultants start at the same basic salary and the same commission. Your career is very fair right from the beginning. When working in recruitment the focus is on how hard you work and therefore how much commission you make. That’s what differentiates you from your colleagues. When I started as a consultant for CP nothing stopped me progressing, it was just about how good I was. Even though CP was, and quite possibly still is, a male dominated sector, success was judged only on merit. In your opinion is there a difference between how men and women progress in their careers? I think it depends more on the individual. It’s important to be able to balance out a work/ family system and I have seen many do it; many of my senior female managers in France have children. In my business 62% of my workforce is female and my management population is a fair 50/50 split. The main challenge for women is that they have to take time out of work to have a family. I have quite a few female managers who have come back to work after having children and work four out of five days a week. Perhaps there is still the mentality that if someone is part time they can’t progress in their career. I don’t agree with this, I think it depends on the individual. It’s my opinion that you can work part time and be more productive in the three or four days a week than someone who works the full five days a week. Have you encountered any gender specific obstacles in your career? I haven’t encountered any gender specific obstacles in my career but when working in a CP environment I had to challenge myself to be tougher as a woman, more so than I may have normally. No matter what industry you work in, it’s important to mix with people, build relationships and show the quality of your work. Do you have any advice for female professionals who are in, or looking to work in, a leadership role? Whether we like it or not the world is still dominated by men, I think if we want to succeed we’ve got to be willing to put the work in. You have to speak up and share your ideas. The quality of your work is important but you also have to participate in every aspect of your role and fully integrate yourself into the business. Whether you’re male or female, everyone has got to prove themselves within their organisation. In France, 39% of respondents said that their organisation did not have formal gender policies in place and 21% weren’t sure. What do you think are the implications of these statistics? I think that all organisations should have gender policies in place. In France it’s something that’s just not spoken about, perhaps that’s a cultural difference. I’ve been away from the UK for 14 years but what shocked me when I first came to France was candidates still using photos in their CV’s (not best practice) and clients asking for a candidate between the age of 30 and 35. This is now becoming less and less prevalent in France but it shows that diversity in the workplace needs to improve. In France, out of the respondents who said their organisation had formal gender policies in place, 90% feel they are adhered to well/fairly well. This implies that gender policies are valued in French companies, is this something you agree with? Yes I would agree with this, when gender policies exist within an organisation they are adhered to well. As I have said 62% of my workforce is female and my management population is a fair 50/50 split. Diversity is important for business. A diverse workforce will generate original ideas and solutions, see risks and opportunities in different ways, which helps maintain a productive and healthy business. Globally, 48% of women do not think they have the same career opportunities as men. In France this statistic is higher and 58% of females do not think they have the same career opportunities as men. What do you think about this? I was surprised by this high percentage. The employment system in France is far more protective of employees than in the UK. It is harder to fire permanent staff in France which means jobs can be more secure. Women have the right to come back after maternity leave to an equivalent job, which is the same as the UK and any country in fact. This feeling in France may be due to culture differences. In 2013 a quota law was introduced to increase the number of women on the boards of the top 17 French companies. However, the low proportion of women in boardrooms is still a big issue in France. Our Executive team, who place senior level roles, report that over the last two years 20% of executive jobs were filled by female candidates. These roles were predominantly in the financial, tax and the HR sector. This is another factor that could influence the 58% of women who feel they do not have the same career opportunities as men. Also, a woman having to take time out of work to have a family is a significant factor in this statistic as well. 45% of female French respondents believe there is equal pay between genders, compared to 76% of male French respondents. Is this an expected trend? I think it depends on the company. In Hays all basic salaries for consultants are the same, as are the Directors basic salaries. It is the commission earned that creates differences and that once again is solely based on ability and merit, not race or gender. It is very equal at Hays but this may not be the same with companies in other industries. I joined Hays straight out of university so equal and fair pay is all I’ve ever known. I don’t have the experience of working for other organisations. French respondents under the age of 25 are less likely to think there is unequal pay between genders. Is this a trend you agree with? I think that Generation Y has a slightly different attitude compared to older generations, they look at life differently. At Hays all consultants start with the same basic salary, they are equal regardless of gender. Graduate salaries across all sectors are the same as well. From my perspective it therefore makes sense that respondents under the age of 25 believe that. Globally respondents (both male and female) believe that allowing more flexible working practices and changes in workplace culture through education across the business, will have the biggest impact on diversity in the workplace. What do you think about this? I think the only way change is going to happen is if it comes from the business, from HR initiatives. If your company culture promotes equal opportunities and an unprejudiced working environment, this will impact diversity in the workplace. Flexible working practises are very important. In France we give a day’s leave if your child is sick so that the mother or father can have the day off to look after the child. It is an additional benefit and one that is appreciated by employees. Within reason flexible time is a positive but if you are running a large team and there is no managerial oversight it can have a negative impact, so it has to be balanced. Share this blog: